Codename: Rebirth

Discuss and unveil current Marathon projects.

Post Feb 1st '09, 22:40

I forget who, but someone has done a voice over complete with floaty green head Durandal for part of a M1 terminal text.
Also, are you going to change 3D engines, like you suggested before? I've put a lot of thought into where this project could go, etc.... and as far as the Pfhorums going down the plughole, this may be what we need to keep it from descending to said nasty situation... This initiative perhaps needs to be the next true incarnation of Marathon. It has become more and more evident that the limitations and challenges of map making, and the A1 engine are becoming a bit of an impedement to progress, and keeps this particular group from becoming a little more expanded. I laud the efforts of Treellama, and others, and hope that work continues to be done on A1, because there will always be room for classic Marathoning in my heart, and I'm sure many other hearts as well. I just think that perhaps now more than ever we need to step into the next era of computing, and let our name be heard.

I truely have mulled over Irons comments on JFO about "this just being a game", and him needing direction for his life.
It, now more than ever, is apparant that this is wrong. Marathon IS a game, true. But I think I understand now why so many left. Marathon lost it's appeal because they lost sight of how awesome the story telling potential of this game is, and the story telling legacy it has. This is no Halo, no COD4. This is Marathon.

That is truely the heart of the thing. Not new netmaps, not shoot-em-up scenarios. Those all have a place, and can be fun though. But the true heart of the thing is that Marathon is a perfect medium for the one thing that the video game industry has lost sight of. Video games are not simply mechanisms for entertainment. They are practically borderline artwork, and an art form unto itself. They are the perfect combination of auditory and visual stimulation to convey a story like no other. You ARE the story, the most any writer could ever try to do to their reader.

That is the true core of the thing. Marathon struck upon one of the best balances of immersion in a story, immersion in the action of the combat within the story, and a good medium to provide it at the time. But the time has somewhat past us by. Innovations in technology have brought greater means to immerse. But they left behind the thing that provides the thread to tie them all together. And we, the Marathon community, stand at the crossroads of both what they have and what they don't. We can provide the thing that was lost.

This is what I now understand. I raged in the chat section, because I saw the great thing that we have, and my childhood being ravaged by apathy.

Don't let the thing that we have here die by attrition. Everyone of you knows that this is what called you to what we have. We only need to realize our potential.
I have been wading in a long river and my feet are wet.
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L'howon
Somewhere outside the Citadel Of Antiquity

Post Feb 2nd '09, 01:53

When I saw that I was like, "whoa crap, an essay!" but I enjoyed your post. I completely agree with you. That CLIQUE secret society, or at least their mantra, is just the dumbest thing I've encountered in recent years. If people want to forget Marathon, then fine, but the fact is, Marathon is one of the greatest pieces of science fiction ever spawned. You don't just tell people forget something cause it's old, and *you* don't like it anymore. I guess I should go tell people to forget about Star Wars. Star Wars is, after all, much older than Marathon, and even though it had far better "graphics," the story isn't quite as good in my opinion. I don't like it, so you should all 4GET Star Wars. And no one new should be added to the Star Wars fanbase. It should die out because I and a few of my friends don't like it so much anymore.

I also get peeved when people (even big names in the industry) say video games can't be art. Video games are one of the most powerful storytelling media out their, and it's just a matter of knowing how to take hold of it. Somehow, in a time when gaming was as complex as "massacre aliens, get key," Bungie did that. With modern technology, this story could become one of the greatest gaming experiences in history.
Last edited by johndoe on Feb 2nd '09, 13:15, edited 1 time in total.
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johndoe
the core

Post Feb 2nd '09, 03:03

Oh come on guys. Like pretty much anything the CLIQUE says, you're not supposed to take it seriously. 4GET is a load of crap. If the idea of 4GET itself wasn't enough to clue you in, check out the spelling. "4GET". At first I was fine sitting back and laughing to myself when anyone would respond like this, but now it's just getting annoying.
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Wrkncacnter

Post Feb 2nd '09, 03:39

Who says I'm saying that I am taking it seriously?

There are those that have taken it to heart, however.

Plus, anything you write is unserious anyways, so meh.

And hey, you and the CLIQUE created it. You get to deal with the aftermath. But, durr, I've never taken it seriously. I just take indignation to the fact that there are those who toss it around like it's some sort of mandate from God. Or irons.

JohnDoe wrote:When I saw that I was like, "whoa crap, an essay!" but I enjoyed your post. I completely agree with you. That CLIQUE secret society, or at least their mantra, is just the dumbest thing I've encountered in recent years. If people want to forget Marathon, then fine, but the fact is, Marathon is one of the greatest pieces of science fiction ever spawned. You don't just tell people forget something cause it's old, and *you* don't like it anymore. I guess I should go people to forget about Star Wars. Star Wars is, after all, much older than Marathon, and even though it had far better "graphics," the story isn't quite as good in my opinion. I don't like it, so you should all 4GET Star Wars. And no one new should be added to the Star Wars fanbase. It should die out because I and a few of my friends don't like it so much anymore.

I also get peeved when people (even big names in the industry) say video games can't be art. Video games are one of the most powerful storytelling media out their, and it's just a matter of knowing how to take hold of it. Somehow, in a time when gaming was as complex as "massacre aliens, get key," Bungie did that. With modern technology, this story could become one of the greatest gaming experiences in history.


Pfhorrest's "I cast level 7 wall of text applies.

Also, since perhaps you haven't been clued in on this yet... most of this crap is perpetrated by W'rk/Irons as a joke. Tuft Founde Oute.
It's not really the mantra of the CLIQUE either... problem is, the CLIQUE is breaking up, and that part is somewhat serious. The dynamic here has changed, and people (*ahem, sweatervest*) are spouting crap about it, even though it's really just drivel, and is driving the community in a wrong direction. As for the rest of your post, exactly. You seem to have caught on to what I was getting at. Although in history, I don't have the hubris to claim... but certainly make some impact, send some shockwaves around the net... perhaps. But that's really just a far off dream, and a lot lies in between that. Which I think is best kept in mind at all times. We could make an impact sure, but we need to be a bit grounded in reality. But no so much as to not dream about what we can do [MGrin] .

With all that in mind, any news to report?
Last edited by L'howon on Feb 2nd '09, 03:50, edited 1 time in total.
I have been wading in a long river and my feet are wet.
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L'howon
Somewhere outside the Citadel Of Antiquity

Post Feb 2nd '09, 04:06

Lh wrote:(*ahem, sweatervest*).


Hey I heard that!
sweatervest

Post Feb 2nd '09, 13:14

Well, if CLIQUE is supposed to be funny, then I surely don't get it. After being on IRC for 20 minutes and then reading their blog, it seemed like a bunch of geeks who take themselves way too seriously... in a really irritating way.

Anyway...

Sorry for forgetting to answer or reply to half of your post. It was late and I was being rushed, two very bad things for my post-writing. [MTongue]

I forget who, but someone has done a voice over complete with floaty green head Durandal for part of a M1 terminal text.
Yeah, I saw that.

Also, are you going to change 3D engines, like you suggested before?

Not anymore. My programmer friend who agreed to work on this with me thinks that the BGE is the best option. He would know way better than I would (he's working on a green-screen keyer, a motion-tracker; he's a pretty dang awesome programmer), so I'll take his word for it. [MGrin]

I've put a lot of thought into where this project could go, etc.... and as far as the Pfhorums going down the plughole, this may be what we need to keep it from descending to said nasty situation... This initiative perhaps needs to be the next true incarnation of Marathon. It has become more and more evident that the limitations and challenges of map making, and the A1 engine are becoming a bit of an impedement to progress, and keeps this particular group from becoming a little more expanded. I laud the efforts of Treellama, and others, and hope that work continues to be done on A1, because there will always be room for classic Marathoning in my heart, and I'm sure many other hearts as well. I just think that perhaps now more than ever we need to step into the next era of computing, and let our name be heard.
I think one of the coolest things that could happen to A1 is people using it to make entirely new games unrelated to Marathon.

I truely have mulled over Irons comments on JFO about "this just being a game", and him needing direction for his life.
It, now more than ever, is apparant that this is wrong.

It sounds to me like you're taking it seriously.

That is the true core of the thing. Marathon struck upon one of the best balances of immersion in a story, immersion in the action of the combat within the story, and a good medium to provide it at the time. But the time has somewhat past us by. Innovations in technology have brought greater means to immerse. But they left behind the thing that provides the thread to tie them all together. And we, the Marathon community, stand at the crossroads of both what they have and what they don't. We can provide the thing that was lost.
That nicely sums up the situation and reason for this project. [MGrin]

This is what I now understand. I raged in the chat section, because I saw the great thing that we have, and my childhood being ravaged by apathy.

Umm, ok... :P


any news to report?

I have the Marine's glove modeled. I could have modeled an entire body by now, but my main problem is that I'm going for realism. I imagine the marine having a flight suit with armor over it, and that means I have to model some wrinkles in the cloth. As I'm sitting here, I think I've figured out a good strategy to proceed with.
Last edited by johndoe on Feb 2nd '09, 13:15, edited 1 time in total.
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johndoe
the core

Post Feb 2nd '09, 13:26

JohnDoe wrote:Wall of text

Thanks for the update.

As far as the flight suit, that's a good idea. I never really thought of it that way, but it really is a flight suit for all intents and purposes.

JohnDoe wrote:That nicely sums up the situation and reason for this project.

Glad I could be of help.
I have been wading in a long river and my feet are wet.
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L'howon
Somewhere outside the Citadel Of Antiquity

Post Feb 2nd '09, 14:06

Why "CLIQUE"? Why the all-caps? Like it's something important?

This clique is bullshit, it is a myth, it doesn't exist.

Yes, Marathon is art, and if you can't see that, too bad.

You know what makes Marathon so good for story telling? IMHO, it's the text. READING! Yes, reading is an active experience, and Marathon has reading in-game, you can be attacked while reading a terminal.
Some text between levels doesn't work as good. An in-game "narrator", something like Cortana's voice in Halo is the next best thing, but I still think text is better.
But I digress...

Marathon's been "dead" before. So "dead" nobody even talked about it being dead. Yet, here we are.
Last edited by ukimalefu on Feb 2nd '09, 21:05, edited 1 time in total.
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ukimalefu

Post Feb 2nd '09, 14:58

JohnDoe wrote:Well, if CLIQUE is supposed to be funny, then I surely don't get it. After being on IRC for 20 minutes and then reading their blog, it seemed like a bunch of geeks who take themselves way too seriously... in a really irritating way.


***Applauds***

Your opinion is something I agree with word by word. I'm not the only one agreeing with you either. Far from it.
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goran

Post Feb 2nd '09, 15:34

John please don't get sucked into the politics here. I am soo excited about what you are doing for this game and, well I can only speak for myself but I will always support your efforts because I really want to see this happen... don't worry about internet silliness.
sweatervest

Post Feb 2nd '09, 18:15

Yeah, don't worry, if there's anything I despise, it's internet political discussions. Mostly because they usually turn out to be anything but discussions. The funny thing is we're talking about some geeky club instead of political parties; this is the only forum I've come across with its own political system... [MErr]


Anywaaay, enough of that. Here's a few hours of work on the Marine. So far he looks a little chubby, but that's only because: 1) flight suits are baggy and puffy, so I'm not adding any significant muscle definition, and 2) any wrinkles will be added *after* I apply the mirror modifier, so that I can make them unsymmetrical.
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Last edited by johndoe on Feb 2nd '09, 18:17, edited 1 time in total.
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johndoe
the core

Post Feb 2nd '09, 18:36

I like your method of modeling John.. That's a good idea. I will claim that I would not have thought to do that, were I in your position.

And who cares about definition anyways. As you said, it's a flight suit. You look like puffy the marshmellow man in them!
Last edited by L'howon on Feb 2nd '09, 20:59, edited 1 time in total.
I have been wading in a long river and my feet are wet.
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L'howon
Somewhere outside the Citadel Of Antiquity

Post Feb 2nd '09, 20:19

John keep up the good work, the stuff in that last screenshot looks great!
Last edited by sweatervest on Feb 2nd '09, 20:59, edited 1 time in total.
sweatervest

Post Feb 2nd '09, 20:34

More codename: rebirth project news. please. :)

Looking good John. Can't wait to see some ingame movies ;)
Last edited by JohannesG on Feb 2nd '09, 20:59, edited 1 time in total.
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JohannesG

Post Feb 2nd '09, 21:05

This post has been edited by appleswitch: Today, 03:59 PM

You missed a few on page three, buddy. Set the bar high.
Last edited by treellama on Feb 2nd '09, 21:05, edited 1 time in total.
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treellama
Pittsburgh

Post Feb 2nd '09, 21:11

JohnDoe wrote:This is the only forum I've come across with its own political system...


You have no idea. [MSmile] We're an interesting group. Read one of the old Anniversary threads sometime.

Any further posts unrelated to Codename: Rebirth will be removed.
Last edited by Switch on Feb 2nd '09, 21:16, edited 1 time in total.
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Switch
NYC

Post Feb 2nd '09, 22:08

Johannes Gunnar: Thanks. Once I have this guy modeled and rigged, you should see some in-game interface and control tests.


More progress below. I will be putting a chestplate on him like in the game, and an equipment belt sorta like in the Mullins painting there, just so you know. And yes, the topology around the armpits is rather bad, but it'll be completely different once I start modeling wrinkles, so I'm not worrying about it for now.
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Last edited by johndoe on Feb 2nd '09, 22:10, edited 1 time in total.
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johndoe
the core

Post Feb 2nd '09, 23:08

JohnDoe wrote:Information


It's like the headless stumpy-legged Marine of Marathon.

Needs a flaming pumpkin.

Also, in my own personal ventures, due to incredible amounts of "Ho mah gawd I'm in 2 AP classes at once, and have homework out the ass on top of sports and everything else I have to do in the day and have no free time-syndrome", I have been somewhat lacking in time to play around with blender. Hopefully, once I get past these first few weeks, the work load will relax just enough for me to have time on the weekends to play around a bit. Sorry. [MErr]
I have been wading in a long river and my feet are wet.
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L'howon
Somewhere outside the Citadel Of Antiquity

Post Feb 2nd '09, 23:24

It's like the headless stumpy-legged Marine of Marathon.
Um, yeah, the boots are kind of not there yet. :P I'm trying to figure how to model them at the moment, cause I don't much like the ones in the Mullins painting. Ooh, as I type this, I've just realized a way to model them so they look like the original sprite, *and* look cool.

Sorry. 3.png

No need to apologize, I haven't even asked for help yet. [MGrin] I have that syndrome too, except without the sports part, which is why all of my projects progress stupidly slowly.
Last edited by johndoe on Feb 2nd '09, 23:25, edited 1 time in total.
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johndoe
the core

Post Feb 3rd '09, 03:09

Looking good man! Just remember, slow progress is better than any progress. I have the same problem with all the self-motivated projects I do.
sweatervest

Post Feb 3rd '09, 19:37

Excellent stuff here! You're doing a great job so far, keep it up.

I do see some problems though. Maybe you're going for form first, but there are lots of stray N-gons and useless polygons on your character that you would do best to iron out. Especially watch out for useless edge loops that might also mess up lighting. I also see that this marine is going to be in at about 3500+ polygons, unoptimized, so you would really do your self a favor by setting a limit on how high you're going. Generally 3000 polys would be fine if you were using normal maps, but not so much without them.
Cold Fusion Games
Marathon: Infested is a fully 3D Marathon game, built from the ground up using a cross platform, stand-alone game engine.
Progress is plentiful...
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infestedsmith
USA

Post Feb 3rd '09, 20:24

must say this looks better and better, keep it up!
What are you, if not seven different shades of stupid?
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CryoS
The Dungeon

Post Feb 4th '09, 00:26

infestedsmith wrote:I do see some problems though. Maybe you're going for form first, but there are lots of stray N-gons and useless polygons on your character that you would do best to iron out. Especially watch out for useless edge loops that might also mess up lighting. I also see that this marine is going to be in at about 3500+ polygons, unoptimized, so you would really do your self a favor by setting a limit on how high you're going. Generally 3000 polys would be fine if you were using normal maps, but not so much without them.


Instead of explaining a bunch of stuff, I'm just going to say, don't worry, looking at the model in its current state makes my eyes bleed too. Like I said, the topology in the upper torso is crap, basically because once the chest-plate is modeled, most of the torso will be removed. Once the entire thing is finished, it'll look a lot prettier.

As for poly-count, I'm very good at reducing things drastically, so it shouldn't be a problem. I want to wait till I have the "base model" completely finished, so I can back it up on a different layer before decimating anything.

Oh, thanks for the compliment, by the way. [MGrin]

Edit: One thing I forgot to mention: Blender doesn't actually support n-gons, it just looks like that because of the wire-drawing method. Everything's in quads and tris.
Last edited by johndoe on Feb 4th '09, 00:28, edited 1 time in total.
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johndoe
the core

Post Feb 4th '09, 00:35

Glad to hear this! You seem to have a solid concept of 3D modeling, I look forward to seeing your finished results.

Btw, Blender DOES in fact have N-Gons, but they're extremely pain-in-rear-end to use. Instead of selecting say, a bunch of vertexes or edges, and creating an N-gon, you have to select a bunch of faces, and create and N-Gon from that, by selecting the faces, and doing F-Make F-Gon.

Btw, you wouldn't happen to be working on a 20" Intel iMac?
Last edited by infestedsmith on Feb 4th '09, 00:35, edited 1 time in total.
Cold Fusion Games
Marathon: Infested is a fully 3D Marathon game, built from the ground up using a cross platform, stand-alone game engine.
Progress is plentiful...
Marathon: Infested
Image
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infestedsmith
USA

Post Feb 4th '09, 01:32

infestedsmith wrote:Btw, you wouldn't happen to be working on a 20" Intel iMac?


An interesting thought. I also would like to hear the response, as I have a 24" Intel iMac upstairs as well. Part of the modeling issue for me is I am on my laptop much more than my iMac, and my laptop is a Macbook. *Hurl*, integrated graphics card.

I'm sure I can almost be guaranteed that my little Macbook would cry unending tear of pain at me if I tried to do any serious modeling with Blender.
I have been wading in a long river and my feet are wet.
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L'howon
Somewhere outside the Citadel Of Antiquity

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