Shots Fired and Visicom's Ballistic Effects in M1A1

Discuss and unveil current Marathon projects.

Post Nov 14th '10, 01:27

So I adapted the James Hastings-Trew's Shots Fired and Visicom's blood and explosions from his Weapon Enhancement Pack to M1A1, and created 2 plugins. Both work wonderfully and I would like to post them. Only I have emailed both of them asking permission to do so, and a week has gone by with no response from either. Judging from the lack of mailer daemon from both addresses, they must have received them ok. What would be proper edicate in this situation? Do any of you know of a better way to contact them or of a different address? I used Visicom's email address here on the pfhorums and James's from his website. It is as both of them walked off the map. [MErr]
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herecomethej2000
Ledyard, CT

Post Nov 14th '10, 02:38

If it were me in your situation: no uploading until there is consent. Don't give up completely just yet. If they check mail as sporadically as I do, you may have more waiting to do before you hear back from them. Search for alternative contacts for them if you can and try those.
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Ares Ex Machina

Post Nov 14th '10, 03:15

How did you adapt these? Most of the M2 sprites look nothing like the M1A1 versions...
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treellama
Pittsburgh

Post Nov 14th '10, 05:52

Treellama wrote:How did you adapt these? Most of the M2 sprites look nothing like the M1A1 versions...


Well from shots fired, I applied smoke, flame, Pfhor Projectile, Fusion projectile, sph't projectile (green for minor yellow for major which is reverse from m2 and minf)

From Visciom's I applied the explosion effects and matched the blood/bullet hits appropriately to whatever monster. This meant I had to create a couple new textures by changing the coloring of the blood for Wasps and Hulks, but it worked out well. It doesn't include M2 weapons and items from the wep, and was meant to work in conjunction with m1redux.
Last edited by herecomethej2000 on Nov 14th '10, 05:57, edited 1 time in total.
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herecomethej2000
Ledyard, CT

Post Nov 14th '10, 13:03

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Last edited by treellama on Nov 14th '10, 13:04, edited 1 time in total.
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treellama
Pittsburgh

Post Nov 14th '10, 16:10

Yup, only the texture is resized a lot smaller automatically because the texture it is replacing isn't as big, and it moves a lot faster, as due to m1 physics. Actually it comes out more oblong as a result of the resizing as well. Personally I don't find the differences all that egregious. Lets face it, the fusion bolts don't exactly look like blue diamonds either in m1 or minf, but we accept this on the account that it is still a good, well drawn effect. If someone would like to draw something closer later down in the road then they are more than welcome too. I just wanted to work with what we already have as I am no visual artist. Anyway its a good start.
Last edited by herecomethej2000 on Nov 14th '10, 16:19, edited 1 time in total.
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herecomethej2000
Ledyard, CT

Post Nov 14th '10, 20:15

herecomethej2000 wrote:I just wanted to work with what we already have as I am no visual artist.

I guess I don't understand. Between the last set and this one you are really giving the impression that you're just creating plugins for the sake of making plugins. Why don't you make something original?
Last edited by treellama on Nov 14th '10, 20:31, edited 1 time in total.
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treellama
Pittsburgh

Post Nov 14th '10, 21:32

Well that's a rather odd, if not mean spirited, thing to say. Especially as I never released a "last set." [MFrown] That last thread was simply to toss the idea of pooling everything we have in a single downloadable package, something that has worked well for other communities.

As with this, I'm not in the slightest claiming that this is my own work, all I am doing is applying what already exists and making use of it in M1A1 where I see it working and wondered why it wasn't done before. As far as I can see, there is absolutely no reason why these textures should not be applied in this situation. Not to mention the fact that you haven't even seen anything yet, so you have nothing to criticize.

I have always taken your comments as you being your usual devil's advocate, but now I'm starting to get a sense of hostility. What did I run over your dog or something? Now I have always respected you and taken your comments seriously, but if you keep this up, I'm going to just have to stop paying attention.
Last edited by herecomethej2000 on Nov 14th '10, 21:46, edited 1 time in total.
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herecomethej2000
Ledyard, CT

Post Nov 14th '10, 22:13

herecomethej2000 wrote:So I adapted the James Hastings-Trew's Shots Fired and Visicom's blood and explosions from his Weapon Enhancement Pack to M1A1, and created 2 plugins. Both work wonderfully and I would like to post them. Only I have emailed both of them asking permission to do so, and a week has gone by with no response from either. Judging from the lack of mailer daemon from both addresses, they must have received them ok. What would be proper edicate in this situation? Do any of you know of a better way to contact them or of a different address? I used Visicom's email address here on the pfhorums and James's from his website. It is as both of them walked off the map. [MErr]


I know everyone around here is a real stickler for respecting intellectual property rights, so I think you've got to wait at least 2 weeks before posting anything without permission. After that, I'd say it's fair game. In the worst case, just strip out the original credits and post it anonymously. It's easy to make a new account at Simplici7y, and no one is around to moderate uploads or cross-reference accounts.
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interion

Post Nov 14th '10, 23:01

herecomethej2000 wrote:I am no visual artist.


Herecomesthej2000, I think you can create highres stuff if you just practice a little. I didn't think I could at first, but then I tried, and it was not as hard as I thought it would be.
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goran

Post Nov 14th '10, 23:03

herecomethej2000 wrote:Well that's a rather odd, if not mean spirited, thing to say. Especially as I never released a "last set." [MFrown] That last thread was simply to toss the idea of pooling everything we have in a single downloadable package, something that has worked well for other communities.

The last thread was about a plugin you claimed at the time to have created by combining enhancement packages including WEP and Shots Fired. At least, that's how it started, before it morphed into something about Freespace which I couldn't follow.

Do you really not see how similar these two threads are?

Not to mention the fact that you haven't even seen anything yet, so you have nothing to criticize.
Before posting anything, I asked what you had done. I have seen M1A1 and the two enhancement packs, which you admitted in your reply is what you've done, so yes, I have seen something--in fact, from what you said, just about everything. If you count a post showing how dissimilar the compiler bolts from Marathon and Shots Fired are as criticism, I think I'm on solid ground.

I have always taken your comments as you being your usual devil's advocate, but now I'm starting to get a sense of hostility. What did I run over your dog or something? Now I have always respected you and taken your comments seriously, but if you keep this up, I'm going to just have to stop paying attention.

You misconstrue hostility with frustration. You frequently misread my replies, FWIW, jumping to "devil's advocate" conclusions from rather neutral statements, which bugs me a little--so maybe that frustration from earlier threads colored my reply. I must say, it often feels like you're already not paying attention, so this threat amused me. Anyway, please ignore any perceived or actual hostility in that post, I will try to avoid expressing frustration in the future, and consider this:

I might be able to get in contact with the authors of these packages, but I would need to justify doing it. If it takes you approximately five minutes of changing numbers in MML and colors in Photoshop to do this, what reason is there for them not to do it or have done it themselves? Surely they know how to do it, since they created the originals. It's unlikely that they didn't do this for reasons of not having an extra five minutes on top of all the real work it took to create the originals. And, surely M1A1 existed when these packs came out, so it's unlikely they didn't do them because they didn't know M1A1 existed. So, the likeliest answers are (a) they don't care about M1A1, which reflects poorly on how well these packages will fit into it, or (b) they actively do not want them to be part of M1A1. If you can think of another situation please reply with it.

So, what it comes down to is, how do we justify asking permission to create something over which they will have no control on Simplici7y, which probably won't fit all that well into M1A1--both because of the compiler bolts I already pointed out, and the glaring difference between the few high res replacements that actually do sort of work, and all of the low res ones where there weren't any replacements you could shoehorn in--realistically, how do I approach them and try to advocate your side on this?

I really feels like you didn't think this through. If you did, and you have answers to all these questions, you're welcome to post them--it would have saved some trouble if you made a stronger argument for them in your first post.

To further explain my comment about making something original: this kind of kerfuffle doesn't happen when you create something all yourself. You don't need to get permission from anybody or justify anything to anybody. You can upload it wherever you want, or keep it to yourself. If you get any criticism you can take it to heart or just ignore it. You can pretty much do whatever you want: that's why creating original stuff is awesome.
Last edited by treellama on Nov 14th '10, 23:05, edited 1 time in total.
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treellama
Pittsburgh

Post Nov 15th '10, 01:14

Treellama wrote:You misconstrue hostility with frustration...
The two are certainly easy to misconstrue and I am sure it has colored my own posts. It was the remark that I was, "making plugins for the sake of making plugins" that irked me, but I agree to proceed with a clear head. That being said...

Treellama wrote:The last thread was about a plugin you claimed at the time to have created by combining enhancement packages including WEP and Shots Fired. At least, that's how it started, before it morphed into something about Freespace which I couldn't follow.
Well that stemed from the fact that in the last thread I made the mistake of misrepresenting myself. I thought that I could drive home what I really was after trough action and then see how you all reacted. When people starting posting valid arguments against it, it was only fitting that I explain why I think it would be a good idea, hence the natural morphing in any conversation. I'll admit I am certainly not winning any literary awards for clarity.

Treellama wrote:I have seen M1A1 and the two enhancement packs, which you admitted in your reply is what you've done, so yes, I have seen something--in fact, from what you said, just about everything. If you count a post showing how dissimilar the compiler bolts from Marathon and Shots Fired are as criticism, I think I'm on solid ground.


Yes, I realize that is fair enough, but if you could see it in action I feel confident that you think the majority of it works and works well. Perhaps your right about the compiler bolts. It was a little while before I decided to play with them, and I certainly didn't think they would work initially, but they almost do work on their own. A specially made texture would be better I have little doubt about that. For any actual release of these plugins I won't include them.

Really, think you hit the nail on the head which is why I do listen to you. My guess is that it is not so much that they didn't care, but that they didn't dream that perhaps some of this stuff could easily apply with a few tweaks. Again, if you think about it, for the most part these effects are not far off. The Pfhor projectile certainly is not, nor smoke, flame or an explosion. With bullet hits, I did manage to have one for every monster. The only 2 that were missing were Wasp and Hulk and that was simply a coloring difference, but I think the end result worked out well. But the reason why I go through trouble and advocate using these specific textures, as oppose to make something different myself (Yes I know in a way that would be easier), is because I feel a consistent experience through the series would be worth it and is good thing. Especially with something like an effect. It is still in the same universe after all.
Again I am no visual artist nor do I have the tools above what is available with Gimp or MSpaint. If someone skilled wants to tackle this project then by all means they should, perhaps I will in a few years, but that is no reason why something like this should not be up in the mean time.
Last edited by herecomethej2000 on Nov 15th '10, 01:15, edited 1 time in total.
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herecomethej2000
Ledyard, CT

Post Nov 15th '10, 11:30

I have released my m1redux and m23redux as 'Plugin's for easy use with the new version of AlephOne.
Can be found on Simplici7y

http://www.simplici7y.com/



I have also repacked the other MODs as 'Plugin's by Tim Vogel, Visciom & Nardo.
I am emailing and awaiting Tim Vogel, Visciom, Nardo @ Bungie's permission regarding if they are re-releasing as Plugin's. OR if they mind if I release on Simplici7y on their behalf.


Until then...they are for my personal archives.
"Beggars CAN be choosers, They just don't eat as often"
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tim4i
Canberra, Australia


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