Physics- why not?

Discuss and unveil current Marathon projects.

Post Mar 28th '11, 06:01

It's been approximated, (though it's up too Attila if he wants to keep it) and I suspect it would b FAR too effective with guidance.
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Dis

Post Mar 28th '11, 10:59

Dis wrote:It's been approximated, (though it's up too Attila if he wants to keep it) and I suspect it would b FAR too effective with guidance.


What if we keep the grenade mod you did, then make them faster and maybe a little more inaccurate to maximize how far they spread, and then mark them as guided? I don't know how guided and wander function together- theoretically the wander would be canceled out, but I've never tried it.

I'm also considering marking major fusion bolt as guided to make the fusion pistol feasible in multiplayer. Thoughts?
AttilaGeek

Post Mar 28th '11, 20:15

Um, player guidance doesn't work w/o Lua. (which doesn't use the mark.)
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Dis

Post Mar 28th '11, 21:18

Dis wrote:Um, player guidance doesn't work w/o Lua. (which doesn't use the mark.)


So it would cause net games to go out of sync unless everybody had it? In other words, it's like custom shapes-only feaasible for single player, right?
AttilaGeek

Post Mar 28th '11, 21:51

No, it would work for everyone, the host would just have to have the lua turned on.
The grenade mod is already quite effective though, with guidance it would be imbalanced.
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Dis

Post Mar 28th '11, 22:28

Dis wrote:No, it would work for everyone, the host would just have to have the lua turned on.
The grenade mod is already quite effective though, with guidance it would be imbalanced.


The grenade mod is really powerful, but IMO it makes the AR too good at close range and so bad at long range that it's almost always better to use the shotgun. Guided grenades would let it compete with the SMG at long range and the shotgun at short range (because it wouldn't affect the first few feet at all) , instead of being a weaker compromise that's useless if you have both.
AttilaGeek

Post Mar 28th '11, 23:03

Something to keep in mind for balance is that Oni was very stingy with ammo, and that despite the scram cannon having five(?) shots, you would likely only get off one or two before someone ran up and disarmed you.
The only choice you have is the one I've already made for myself. Disappear into the darkness. Then make them fear the shadows.

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SirBlastalot
Currently marooned on Earth, please assist!

Post Mar 28th '11, 23:05

SirBlastalot wrote:Something to keep in mind for balance is that Oni was very stingy with ammo, and that despite the scram cannon having five(?) shots, you would likely only get off one or two before someone ran up and disarmed you.


Aah. See, there's no disarming in marathon, but what I was thinking of each shot being a whole grenade clip, which netmaps and singleplayer alike are also stingy with.
AttilaGeek

Post Mar 28th '11, 23:14

The thing to remember is that even if only one of the grenades hits, it will put the player on the receiving end at a significant disadvantage when faced with the primary fire, which is pretty difficult to avoid at mid range, and even without the grenades it's a feasible option at that distance.
Last edited by Dis on Mar 28th '11, 23:16, edited 1 time in total.
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Dis

Post Mar 28th '11, 23:19

Dis wrote:The thing to remember is that even if only one of the grenades hits, it will put the player on the receiving end at a significant disadvantage when faced with the primary fire


True. Maybe we should lower the grenade damage from 60-80 to 20-30 or so?
Because chances are just a few grenades are going to hit at mid range, and you'll be able to dodge them at long range. Since you already have the physics file, do you want to do that and then send it back to me because another thing I want to do with it is turn the fusion pistol into a railgun.
AttilaGeek

Post Mar 29th '11, 01:43

brilliant wrote:Yeah, check out Quantum of Lua on S7 by Tim. It is really fun to play, and all this talk about it makes me want to play it again!

Ah, thanks. My search for "guided rockets lua" came up with nothing because I didn't know the actual title.
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Ares Ex Machina

Post Mar 29th '11, 05:12

AttilaGeek wrote:Aah. See, there's no disarming in marathon, but what I was thinking of each shot being a whole grenade clip, which netmaps and singleplayer alike are also stingy with.


That would work.

Dis wrote:The thing to remember is that even if only one of the grenades hits, it will put the player on the receiving end at a significant disadvantage when faced with the primary fire, which is pretty difficult to avoid at mid range, and even without the grenades it's a feasible option at that distance.


Maybe even less. I seem to recall the rockets hardly doing any damage in Oni. I wonder if there's a clever way to make them not activate at close range. (as in the original)
The only choice you have is the one I've already made for myself. Disappear into the darkness. Then make them fear the shadows.

"Real life, getting in the way of nerds since 1983"
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SirBlastalot
Currently marooned on Earth, please assist!

Post Mar 29th '11, 07:22

Are you going to make special maps to balance the weapons out? If there's enough major changes to the weapons, it will screw with map balance and you'll end up with some really shoddy games.
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LegacyTyphoon

Post Mar 29th '11, 11:03

Grayswandir wrote:Are you going to make special maps to balance the weapons out? If there's enough major changes to the weapons, it will screw with map balance and you'll end up with some really shoddy games.


Well, my goal is to have it be similar enough to standard that it can be played without custom maps or shapes, which means I'm sticking to the same color tables, the same shapes, and at the very least the same weapon definitions that we all know and love. I'm not going to put in a crossbow or sword or maser (from Phoenix, Eternal, and Rubicon respectively), but I do want it to be new and different.just not that new or different.
AttilaGeek

Post Mar 29th '11, 15:59

Because this thread has turned into more of a collaborative physics-making effort ( :C ) I am moving it to Projects.
underworld : simple fun netmaps // prahblum peack : simple rejected netmaps
azure dreams : simple horrible netmaps // v6.0!!!: thomas mann's greatest hits : simple simple netmaps
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irons
(.Y.)

Post Mar 29th '11, 23:23

Hopefully my postings won't be used against me in my future political career.
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Dis

Post Mar 29th '11, 23:51

Dis wrote:...my future political career.

Galactic President is already taken.
Love Marathon, and also play Doom on modern source ports? You might like these skins!
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President People

Post Mar 30th '11, 21:04

Dis wrote:Hopefully my postings won't be used against me in my future political career.


Political career?
...Dis for Galactic President official physics-helper!
AttilaGeek

Post Apr 19th '11, 14:52

Hey everyone, sorry for not finishing the model, but I've been having some non-marathon related issues recently. Also, i have a small problem with the fusion pistol bolts- they don't do damage. They have a blast radius that can and will hurt the player if you fire it against a wall, but when shooting at another player they don't do anything except for a hit about one time out of ten. I've playtested it a lot against aliens, and it seems to work occasionally, but not always. Has anyone else had this problem or know how to fix it?
AttilaGeek

Post Apr 19th '11, 15:16

Do they have a projectile radius?
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treellama
Pittsburgh

Post Apr 19th '11, 16:16

Treellama wrote:Do they have a projectile radius?


Yes- 51 and 102 for the minor and major bolts, respectively.
AttilaGeek

Post Apr 19th '11, 16:31

So do they just fly right through other players?
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treellama
Pittsburgh

Post Apr 19th '11, 17:11

Treellama wrote:So do they just fly right through other players?


No- I took the P&V off the major bolt to see if that would fix it, but it doesn't. They will detonate harmlessly against other players and sometimes hurt aliens, but if you shoot either at point-blank range at a wall they will always hurt you.
AttilaGeek

Post Apr 19th '11, 17:32

So they detonate, but don't do damage? Do you have a detonation effect set? Is your area of effect very small?

Better leave P&V off, btw, it will not be fixed for 1.0. Use Lua if you need P&V.
Last edited by treellama on Apr 19th '11, 17:33, edited 1 time in total.
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treellama
Pittsburgh

Post Apr 19th '11, 17:35

They detonate if you shoot it at a wall, but against a player they will only intermittently do damage. Do you want me to PM it to you to show you?
AttilaGeek

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