Space0ut, a (terrible) duel map...

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Space0ut, a (terrible) duel map...

Post Jan 24th '16, 05:33

Screenies (Can't seem to resize images if they're in an album so they're here)

Space0ut is a one on one duel map (though the first five teams each have a single spawn). Small, and with a split second between cover and sightlines, this map is fast and frantic. Shotguns, Fusion Pistols, Assault Rifles, and an Alien weapon can be found as time and carnage progresses. Sadly, I only have a single device capable of running Marathon at the moment, so if somebody could provide feedback here or pm me about weapon spawns and whatnot, I'll be happy to improve this map how I can.

The texture work is rough as my goal was simply a playable map for now, but as I learn new and more efficient map techniques, I'll improve and remake this. Space0ut will work on both M2, and Infinity, but was textured for Infinity and will possibly burn your retinas, or impressions of my map if played using M2.

Again this is my first complete attempt at a map (I learned the value of saving changes like a lunatic) so I really value any feedback you can give me to heart, and I'm eager to improve my creation skills. ^_^

Simplici7y Link

Original Post (Question about texture sets):
Spoiler:
I'm working on a duel map after realizing that I thought my maps were bigger than they actually are, but since I switched my shapes file from M2 to MI, I completely butchered my original idea in terms of colouring and surfaces. I've adapted it to work with Infinity, but I've ended up using textures from Pfhor and Water textures at the same time.

As long as the map is played with Aleph One and not original M2/MI, am I correct in thinking there won't be any issues?

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Last edited by Neonstar on Jan 24th '16, 08:18, edited 1 time in total.
Sometimes, you've got to get better, before you can get better.
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Neonstar
New Zealand

Post Jan 24th '16, 06:31

Yeah, that's fine. A number of released maps use multiple texture sets in one level. Objectively, the level will take longer to load and use more video memory, but not enough to bother most people. Subjectively, textures from different sets may not complement each other well, and I've heard it argued new mapmakers should stay in one texture set as a way of staying 'grounded' before they go too crazy. Those are the only disadvantages that come to mind.
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Crater Creator

Post Jan 24th '16, 08:18

Updated post from question to map showcase.
Sometimes, you've got to get better, before you can get better.
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Neonstar
New Zealand

Post Jan 24th '16, 09:15

This is pretty good for a first map, I think. It's clear that you already have a basic understanding of map structure and flow, as well as differential shading, which is good to see. A few points:

- Multiplayer maps generally require a large amount of weapons and ammo. A good idea is to cluster these weapons and ammo together, and near spawn points. What weapons you choose to use depend on the map's size and your intended goal, but make sure players get access to them quickly after they spawn so they have a fair chance to fight. A 100% spawn rate is generally used for weapons and ammo these days.

- As Crater said, it's easy to overuse textures from multiple sets. Each set was designed with specific colors, themes, and patterns in mind, and combining them can cause the map's appearance to clash with itself. There are certain combinations, however, that do work well and are used together fairly often these days. The white texture from water set, and the red ones from lava, can mix well, along with different soil textures and some of the 'light' textures. It's a subjective thing, so it depends on your taste. Water and pfhor sets are nearly impossible to mix, so you might want to rework that element of the map.

- The teleporter's destination is a lower polygon in a trench. I'd suggest raising it above the trench and making it a ledge. Otherwise, people might confuse the destination polygon for a teleporter, and get annoyed when it takes them nowhere.

Anyways, good job, and I look forward to seeing more of your work! [spnkr]
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Windbreaker
South Park, CO

Post Jan 24th '16, 09:21

Space0ut 0.02: I have improved upon suggestions from above (Thanks for your feedback, every bit helps!), and balanced out the south side a bit.

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The teleporter in front of the south spawn was a sort of anti-camp measure so a player couldn't just hang below, but it now directly takes you to the improved alien weapon spawn (now raised and only accessable via the teleporter), however you have to stand in a very specific spot, and it is blocked half the time, as the surrounding polygon (original teleporter) will move every 20 seconds to prevent anyone from constantly running into it. At the same time, the south balcony overlooking the 'courtyard', also now raises and lowers. Lowered is identical to before, but raised blocks the player from running off it, and also blocks the courtyard itself. Sightlines to/from the north cover, are unchanged when the platform is raised, so now you can pick on the north side and don't need to worry about below (for 20 seconds)

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I've changed out the lighting slightly, contrasting should be better, and I dumped more (an unhealthy amount) ammo around the map as symmetrically as I could. Everything is 100 percent spawn, except the alien weapon, health pickups, and shotguns. I only have a single device capable of running Marathon, so can someone else check if the item spawns work?

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(Simplici7y download link has been updated to this version)
Sometimes, you've got to get better, before you can get better.
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Neonstar
New Zealand

Post Jan 25th '16, 12:24

New map in progress, Heated Discussion. This one is a lava based arena with two rooms overlooking (with staircases down the sides to) a central lava courtyard. I plan to make the courtyard submersible by a switch system which can be deactivated to lower but also automatically lowers after time back to the starting height.

Assault Rifles and Shotguns with ammo are around outside the middle room, while a Rocket with ammo lies in the middle for someone to snag if fast enough. I feel like Shotguns might ruin the gameplay and restrict players to the side corridors so they're a maybe until tested out.

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Also, would it be a better option to merge all levels together, or keep them separate downloads? (while I'm still designing them)
Sometimes, you've got to get better, before you can get better.
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Neonstar
New Zealand

Post Jan 25th '16, 12:33

Here's some feedback on the first map v0.02:
  • It's weird to have a landscape texture you can walk on, because landscapes are supposed to look like they're an infinite distance away. Landscapes are generally reserved for the sky, and areas 'outside' your map you can't visit.

  • Try to follow conventions when it comes to texturing. We talked about mixing water & Pfhor textures, but in particular, you have alcoves with bright green floors adjacent to bright red, pfhorslime floors. It's not good aesthetically, and it breaks the convention that a liquid texture indicates a liquid.

  • I don't get what you're going for with the platforms. Players expect platforms to be responsive, not to have to wait 20 seconds for them. Accordingly platforms in netmaps are most often controlled by players, not on a timer or switch or anything else. If the delay is long so that players get bored and move on before using it as a mechanism for changing their height, there's probably a better way.

  • The south teleporter is now this cute little raised white tile. It makes for a nice architectural accent. But players don't want to stumble around trying to stop in just the right spot for the teleporter to activate. If surrounding the teleporter in platforms is the way to go - and it may not be - then make the teleporter like half a square WU in area or larger.

  • Items aren't spawning because they're set to "Teleports In." That requires an item trigger polygon. I wouldn't bother for this map.

  • I found much of the map too dark, particularly the west staircase.* If you don't want to wash things out, consider adding a couple bright panels, or shading either the inside or outside curve to be significantly brighter. You can also try running my EasyShade plugin on your map - not necessarily to finish lighting it, but to get a sense of how and where directional lighting can make the shape of your map easier to navigate.

  • Building on the last point, not many first maps do differential shading, but you seem to already be going down that path. One principle of differential shading is that if you have a wall facing a given angle, that happens to be split among multiple lines, you expect the whole wall to have the same brightness if there isn't an implied light source hitting only part of it. The east and west walls of polygon 47 are darker than the adjacent east & west walls, when I can see no reason for that.

* Part of this is that the wall texture used is especially dark in Goran's high-res texture pack. This creates a conundrum - do mappers light their levels to look good with original textures, or replacement textures? And what about how maps look darker in OpenGL Shader than OpenGL Classic? I myself get the lighting to look the way I want in Classic, and I've emphasized matching the overall color & brightness of the originals in my feedback on the textures.
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Crater Creator

Post Jan 25th '16, 13:20

http://imgur.com/a/QIqOw

I've removed the standout textures (including courtyard floor), and lighting should be smoother, better, and completely identical on east and west sides. I'll fix alignment later.

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I've moved the teleporter to a small room to the side, and the balcony is now a controllable platform that lowers when activated (still raises back after a while). Textures and lighting rushed for the moment.

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Item spawn fixed, thanks for that.

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Additionally, is there a way to resize entire Aleph One maps? I found one tool called Chisel, but none of my PPC Mac programs seem to want to recognize .SceA, I thought they were native format, do I need to change extensions or something?
Sometimes, you've got to get better, before you can get better.
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Neonstar
New Zealand


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