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Post Aug 16th '12, 09:14

President People wrote:http://marathon.bungie.org/story/terms/m2/M2.27.1.1.1.gif
Personally, I don't trust the typo in skraeling's quote.

Then you must not trust the typo in the game either.
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Ares Ex Machina

Post Aug 16th '12, 09:53

It surprises me that some of this is being debated. We know for a fact that the Pfhor have skeletons. And it's clear they have skin. If there is chitin, it's under the skin.

As for what Tycho or Durandal say, don't always take them literally. Both of them have a sense of humor and take literary liberties left and right.

goran wrote:they are born in eggs

Are they?

goran wrote:they have wasps

So do we.

goran wrote:When they build cyborgs they give them pincers.

When we build robots, we give them pincers.

goran wrote:They are bony.

How does this support them being insect-like?

goran wrote:They speak goddamn weird.

I would be shocked if an alien spoke and didn't sound weird, whether or not it was insect-like.

goran wrote:They dont breath air.

Then why do they have it in their ships?

goran wrote:The only thing that is humanoid about them is their general shape, that they have two legs, two arms, and a head.

As you now know, you pretty much defined humanoid here. But they also have bones, skin, and opposable thumbs.
Last edited by Ares Ex Machina on Aug 16th '12, 11:48, edited 1 time in total.
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Ares Ex Machina

Post Aug 16th '12, 18:19

Ok let us be reasonable. Pfhor are not insects and pfhor are not humans. They are what they are. If we look at the pfhor species as a whole many of them are human like, but there are also other qualities to them, qualities I refer to as insect-like.

Pfhor are found in eggs as we see in M1. The alien inside is most similar to a fighter among the pfhor we know of. Many species on earth lay eggs. Among them are fish, birds, and insects.
http://marathon.bungie.org/story/_images/pfhoreggpillar.jpg

Pfhor got three or more eyes and none of them got pupils. Insects got eyes like these.

Pfhor blood is for the most part yellow. Insects got yellow blood.

Many pfhor species have an insect like look. Wasps, lookers, m1_hunters, the unreleased hound (found together with hunter in m1 manual), the spider (also unreleased).

Durandal and Tycho both made comments on pfhor+bugs in infinity.

I hope you understand why I have come to think of them as being inspired by insects.

I do not know what advice I could give to Envy that would be most helpful. As it is, his pfhor got too much of a human physique and not at all the light-weight grim look of marathon pfhor. His skin is too loose. Many limbs are too thick. The head lacks the "skull look". I still think insects is the right approach for inspiration. How to make the thin look work. Look tough and evil, yet thin.
Last edited by goran on Aug 16th '12, 18:22, edited 1 time in total.
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goran

Post Aug 16th '12, 20:23

I'll rework it with chitin plates, skin between them, and bones, and end this madness.
Si tratta di una lacrimosa.
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envy
Land of the New Rising Sun

Post Aug 16th '12, 20:39

goran wrote:Ok let us be reasonable. Pfhor are not insects and pfhor are not humans. They are what they are. If we look at the pfhor species as a whole many of them are human like, but there are also other qualities to them, qualities I refer to as insect-like.

Pfhor are found in eggs as we see in M1. The alien inside is most similar to a fighter among the pfhor we know of. Many species on earth lay eggs. Among them are fish, birds, and insects.
http://marathon.bungie.org/story/_images/pfhoreggpillar.jpg

Pfhor got three or more eyes and none of them got pupils. Insects got eyes like these.

Pfhor blood is for the most part yellow. Insects got yellow blood.

Many pfhor species have an insect like look. Wasps, lookers, m1_hunters, the unreleased hound (found together with hunter in m1 manual), the spider (also unreleased).

Durandal and Tycho both made comments on pfhor+bugs in infinity.

I hope you understand why I have come to think of them as being inspired by insects.

I do not know what advice I could give to Envy that would be most helpful. As it is, his pfhor got too much of a human physique and not at all the light-weight grim look of marathon pfhor. His skin is too loose. Many limbs are too thick. The head lacks the "skull look". I still think insects is the right approach for inspiration. How to make the thin look work. Look tough and evil, yet thin.


That's much more reasonable. However, I will say you seem to be jumping to conclusions with the Pfhor egg.

According to the page, J. Reginald Dujour of Bungie points out that the Pfhor eggs are in fact "incubation bubbles". The implication here is that they are not eggs. Otherwise why not call them Pfhor eggs? As for why they are incubating and to what extent, that's another mystery. Maybe these bubbles are what they put injured Pfhor into to heal them. Or maybe they're incubation pods for clones that are genetically manufactured to quickly increase their number of soldiers.
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Ares Ex Machina

Post Aug 16th '12, 22:52

Ares Ex Machina wrote:Then you must not trust the typo in the game either.

That's what I meant. Knew I should've worded it better.
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President People

Post Aug 17th '12, 17:09

Even at such a small size, the M2 sprites have clear muscle definition and anatomy. Notice they have analogues to collarbones, pecs, and muscles in the thighs and upper arms. Your model lacks that underlying musculature -- the bumps in the limbs just look random, instead of tracing the contours of bones and muscles based on physical principles.

I think you need more life-drawing experience before you'll reach the next level in figure modeling. Your marines also suffered the same doughiness that indicated a lack of anatomical understanding. This stuff is hard, I know, but to build a plausible creature you need to think about it from the inside out.
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Hopper

Post Aug 17th '12, 22:56

Ares Ex Machina wrote:That's much more reasonable. However, I will say you seem to be jumping to conclusions with the Pfhor egg.

According to the page, J. Reginald Dujour of Bungie points out that the Pfhor eggs are in fact "incubation bubbles". The implication here is that they are not eggs. Otherwise why not call them Pfhor eggs? As for why they are incubating and to what extent, that's another mystery. Maybe these bubbles are what they put injured Pfhor into to heal them. Or maybe they're incubation pods for clones that are genetically manufactured to quickly increase their number of soldiers.


An egg and an incubation bubble are not so unlike each other. One is natural, the other one is constructed. I was wrong, but I do not agree I jumped to conclusions. It looks like a natural egg, and many people thought so until the mapmaker said it was an incubation bubble (artificial egg).
Last edited by goran on Aug 17th '12, 23:04, edited 1 time in total.
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goran

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