Intending to start Eternal Tour of Duty soon

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Intending to start Eternal Tour of Duty soon

Post Mar 3rd '19, 23:17

I was intending to start after pushing through the Halo games on their original hardware (Halo 1+2 on Xbox, the 360 games on 360 except CEA & 4) in chronological order alongside the Marathon Trilogy on Mac without HD textures on and PID Aleph One on windows, but that will take too long so I can play those on the side.

I will be using Eternal X Omega (the latest version of 1.1.0) as my Tour of Duty one as I haven't played much Eternal since beating that version for the first time, so I'd like to document it via text let's play. However, Eternal 1.2 is the more up to date one so after finishing this one, I intend to do a Bonus writeup summarising all the highlights of 1.2 that are different to the main Tour version that I notice. There are at least a couple I know of. I will be using my Mac version of Eternal 1.2 for that so I can use the HD textures; a bug in Aleph One for windows causes out of memory errors if the MML for HD textures is active, despite my windows and mac computers having the exact same amount of RAM. I have no idea why it does that.

Before starting on the prologue and first chapter, I need some suggestions on how to handle maps and terminals: I will be running Eternal through Steam as a shortcut so I can take screenshots and link to them better than my log like I had to do with Pathways into Darkness. (PID Tour writeups are on the Story Page and it's finally complete. Chapters are 0 to 7 + Final Zone/Final Chapter)

However, I am worried about how much space I will use up on Steam Cloud for the Tour Screenshots, and that's after cleaning some room earlier tonight. It's just under 16 gig remaining, though screenshots are in jpg as far as I've seen and usually number in the kilobytes. Those add up though and I'm doing Tomb Raider, DUSK and possibly Mother 3 screenshots too for unrelated personal logging.

Level maps and terminals will use up the most I reckon, so what is the best way to handle those? I intend images for each Terminal screen as well as each bad ending plank, though I may not use all of them. All maps as well, though they'd also need annotations for readers if using as a walkthrough. Terminals I may be able to take myself if I'm selective about which I photograph. As for maps... I'm not sure.

Any suggestions are welcome. I also don't know if it's best to cover multiple maps at a time like I did with PID (though PID sort of required it) or not, as I don't want this one to last 4 years or longer like my PID one did. Less than one if I can help it.

I also hope to do a Halo 1 PC: Single Player Version 3 mod writeup too after Eternal and Eternal 1.2 at some point.
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Lion O Cyborg
UK (which is IN EUROPE!)

Post Mar 4th '19, 01:03

For the record, we're hoping to get the official release of 1.2 out within a week. There are a few minor gameplay issues to address and at least one last-minute bug fix to implement, but it's 99.9% done. This won't be the final release of the game, as I had a number of major planned changes that didn't get implemented because, to put it bluntly, I went mad for a couple of months. However, it will, barring the discovery of some other, previously unnoticed game-breaking bug, be the final release of 1.2. (There will hopefully be another release - IDK if it'll be called 1.3 or something else - at the end of the year.)

In short, I'd advise you to wait until we're done with 1.2 - it probably won't be much longer than you were planning to wait anyway, and it's a much more pleasant experience, at least judging from Dr Sumner's response to "Deep Into the Grotto" (he ragequit the 1.1 version and had nothing but praise for the 1.2 version). The only reason I could see someone preferring 1.1 is for speedrunning (an exploit that allowed a player to skip from "To Sleep, Perchance to Dream" to the final level has been removed from 1.2).
“People should not be afraid of their governments. Governments should be afraid of their people.” —V, V for Vendetta (Alan Moore)

“The trouble is that we have a bad habit, encouraged by pedants and sophisticates, of considering happiness as something rather stupid. Only pain is intellectual, only evil interesting. This is the treason of the artist: a refusal to admit the banality of evil and the terrible boredom of pain. If you can’t lick ’em, join ’em. If it hurts, repeat it. But to praise despair is to condemn delight, to embrace violence is to lose hold of everything else. We have almost lost hold; we can no longer describe happy man, nor make any celebration of joy.” —Ursula K. Le Guin, “The Ones Who Walk Away from Omelas”

“If others had not been foolish, we should be so.” —William Blake, The Marriage of Heaven and Hell

Last.fm · Marathon Chronicles · Marathon Eternal 1.2 · Where Monsters Are in Dreams · YouTube Vidmaster’s Challenge
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The Man
Sarasota, FL

Post Mar 4th '19, 08:31

The Man wrote:For the record, we're hoping to get the official release of 1.2 out within a week. There are a few minor gameplay issues to address and at least one last-minute bug fix to implement, but it's 99.9% done. This won't be the final release of the game, as I had a number of major planned changes that didn't get implemented because, to put it bluntly, I went mad for a couple of months. However, it will, barring the discovery of some other, previously unnoticed game-breaking bug, be the final release of 1.2. (There will hopefully be another release - IDK if it'll be called 1.3 or something else - at the end of the year.)

In short, I'd advise you to wait until we're done with 1.2 - it probably won't be much longer than you were planning to wait anyway, and it's a much more pleasant experience, at least judging from Dr Sumner's response to "Deep Into the Grotto" (he ragequit the 1.1 version and had nothing but praise for the 1.2 version). The only reason I could see someone preferring 1.1 is for speedrunning (an exploit that allowed a player to skip from "To Sleep, Perchance to Dream" to the final level has been removed from 1.2).


OK. I still intend to do 1.1 first, but I'm happy to wait until the most complete version of 1.2 is ready before doing the highlights bonus. Part of the draw is that the previous full build of eternal to 1.1 was the first one I played, back in 2013 I think. It was my first Marathon mod and my first exposure to PID's monsters. 1.1 is a little different to the one I grew up with (technically grew up with: I was 17 at the time I first played Eternal 1.0) and some maps were changed around or cut, with new ones in their places but overall it's a better version than 1.0, especially the new levels.

The PID monsters are another part of that draw, though they are updated into Kamala demon like versions of themselves in 1.2 and look pretty good. Headless get replaced with skitters I think. The 1.2 versions of the PID monsters are one of the highlights I intend to cover in the 1.2 write up, whenever that may be, depending on the release of the official 1.2 build, the other major one I know of besides HD stuff being the restored water in flames of Icarus (and a map name change to match).

I even beat 1.0 or 1.1 Vidmaster style when I did my very first Vidmaster run of the trilogy, as Eternal was the only mod I had at the time. (I forget which version it was I beat that way)

Anyway, what was the best way to handle map and terminal screenshots for the 1.1 run?
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Lion O Cyborg
UK (which is IN EUROPE!)

Post Mar 4th '19, 15:12

there wouldn't be much value in doing both a 1.1 and 1.2 writeup. unlike the 1.0 -> 1.1 version bump, the level layouts and story are basically the same; 1.2 is mostly additions, fixes, and higher-quality graphics. where levels or story are different, it's mostly additions rather than replacements. also, you can disable nightmare and skitter transparency by disabling the hd monsters plugin.

so basically the only thing that is outright different is the slow headless have been replaced with some much more fun to fight skitters, and the weapon physics are balanced better.

the best way to handle screenshots is to press F9. I don't know/care anything about why you would want to put your computer in a "steam cloud."
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ravenshining
Hawai'i

Post Mar 4th '19, 16:13

ravenshining wrote:there wouldn't be much value in doing both a 1.1 and 1.2 writeup. unlike the 1.0 -> 1.1 version bump, the level layouts and story are basically the same; 1.2 is mostly additions, fixes, and higher-quality graphics. where levels or story are different, it's mostly additions rather than replacements. also, you can disable nightmare and skitter transparency by disabling the hd monsters plugin.

so basically the only thing that is outright different is the slow headless have been replaced with some much more fun to fight skitters, and the weapon physics are balanced better.

the best way to handle screenshots is to press F9. I don't know/care anything about why you would want to put your computer in a "steam cloud."


Good to know. The 1.2 part was going to be a single bonus writeup showing highlights of that version. Based on what you've told me about the exact changes, I guess I could do it the other way around and the bonus would be to show off the differences in 1.1, mainly the changes I know of, like the old PID monster design.

As for screenshots, F9 does work, but what I mean by Steam Cloud is this:


https://steamcommunity.com/profiles/765 ... &view=grid

https://steamcommunity.com/profiles/765 ... &view=grid

https://steamcommunity.com/profiles/765 ... &view=grid
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Lion O Cyborg
UK (which is IN EUROPE!)

Post Mar 4th '19, 17:37

Seconding what Aaron and Lia said about playing 1.2 being a better idea.

WRT Steam Cloud, are you just looking for a place to host your screenshots? A free image host like imgur might be fine for that if that's all you need.
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Pfhorrest
California

Post Mar 4th '19, 17:43

Pfhorrest wrote:Seconding what Aaron and Lia said about playing 1.2 being a better idea.

WRT Steam Cloud, are you just looking for a place to host your screenshots? A free image host like imgur might be fine for that if that's all you need.


Thanks, but I don't use imgur. I did use my log for PID but I was hoping not to need to do that this time. The Steam screenshots is because I'm recording snaps of the games on Steam via the shortcuts for any non Marathon players, as well as to give my own thoughts, as I have no way of producing video Let's Plays on youtube. I have good ideas for what my style would be, but I know I'd be crap at it.

I will have to use my log for other images that could appear though, like the ooze and toilet flush joke I made about the chains on Never Stop Firing.

I agree with using 1.2 instead now and will just use 1.1 for the bonus round: the bonus was only going to be a single post detailing differences anyway. Unless I leave out the bonus round entirely and just include the differences in the main posts where available? Either way, that means I can play 1.1 on my own while waiting for 1.2's later release as practice. (though I thought beta 10 was the final one?)
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Lion O Cyborg
UK (which is IN EUROPE!)

Post Mar 4th '19, 18:46

Beta 10 is the final beta, so the only differences between it and the release will be whatever bugs are found and fixed while making a final run of playtests, of which there are already several. But there'll be no new or redone content in the final that's not in beta 10.
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Pfhorrest
California

Post Mar 4th '19, 19:07

Pfhorrest wrote:Beta 10 is the final beta, so the only differences between it and the release will be whatever bugs are found and fixed while making a final run of playtests, of which there are already several. But there'll be no new or redone content in the final that's not in beta 10.


Will there be a workaround or fix for the windows HD textures memory bug? No harm if it can't be done as it gives my the perfect excuse to use my Mac version instead, but it'd still be nice so I can use HD textures on both.
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Lion O Cyborg
UK (which is IN EUROPE!)

Post Mar 4th '19, 19:36

The beta of Aleph One 1.3 will load all the HD textures on Windows if you need screenshots, but it still has performance issues (it stutters fairly regularly). If you want to use the HD textures, I recommend using the Mac version.
“People should not be afraid of their governments. Governments should be afraid of their people.” —V, V for Vendetta (Alan Moore)

“The trouble is that we have a bad habit, encouraged by pedants and sophisticates, of considering happiness as something rather stupid. Only pain is intellectual, only evil interesting. This is the treason of the artist: a refusal to admit the banality of evil and the terrible boredom of pain. If you can’t lick ’em, join ’em. If it hurts, repeat it. But to praise despair is to condemn delight, to embrace violence is to lose hold of everything else. We have almost lost hold; we can no longer describe happy man, nor make any celebration of joy.” —Ursula K. Le Guin, “The Ones Who Walk Away from Omelas”

“If others had not been foolish, we should be so.” —William Blake, The Marriage of Heaven and Hell

Last.fm · Marathon Chronicles · Marathon Eternal 1.2 · Where Monsters Are in Dreams · YouTube Vidmaster’s Challenge
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The Man
Sarasota, FL

Post Mar 4th '19, 19:45

The Man wrote:The beta of Aleph One 1.3 will load all the HD textures on Windows if you need screenshots, but it still has performance issues (it stutters fairly regularly). If you want to use the HD textures, I recommend using the Mac version.

It stutters on YOUR PC with the texture resolution turned all the way up. That doesn't mean it will stutter on anybody else's PC, especially if they configure the graphics options to match their video card's capabilities.
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treellama
Pittsburgh

Post Mar 4th '19, 19:51

treellama wrote:
The Man wrote:The beta of Aleph One 1.3 will load all the HD textures on Windows if you need screenshots, but it still has performance issues (it stutters fairly regularly). If you want to use the HD textures, I recommend using the Mac version.

It stutters on YOUR PC with the texture resolution turned all the way up. That doesn't mean it will stutter on anybody else's PC, especially if they configure the graphics options to match their video card's capabilities.


On my windows machine and my Mac, the beta builds of Aleph One 1.3 do not work at all. They fail to load a large number of maps including the first one in every game I try it with except PID A1 (which works fine) and boot me back to the main menu 1 second after loading the map instead of crashing the game. I made another thread on this elsewhere on the Pfhorums.

I'll need to wait until a stable windows release of Aleph One 1.3 comes out before I switch.
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Lion O Cyborg
UK (which is IN EUROPE!)

Post Mar 4th '19, 21:22

Unless you file a bug / provide more information, the final version will almost certainly work the same way.
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treellama
Pittsburgh

Post Mar 4th '19, 21:35

treellama wrote:Unless you file a bug / provide more information, the final version will almost certainly work the same way.


Here.

viewtopic.php?f=22&t=53669

http://forums.bungie.org/story/?noframes;read=72016

I don't have a Github account so this will have to do.
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Lion O Cyborg
UK (which is IN EUROPE!)

Post Mar 4th '19, 23:37

That post doesn't say anything about Windows (or anything about your system specs), just that it doesn't work on your Mac. I think we would have noticed if both the Mac and Windows builds of the beta release didn't work altogether(!), so it has to be something specific to your setup/preferences.

Can you try deleting your preferences, as well as disabling your plugins?
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treellama
Pittsburgh

Post Mar 4th '19, 23:48

One thing about AOPID (which is the only scenario working for him), the mouse aiming is disabled by default. I mention that in case it's relevant, because of the controller related issues in the log file.
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Wrkncacnter

Post Mar 5th '19, 09:22

treellama wrote:That post doesn't say anything about Windows (or anything about your system specs), just that it doesn't work on your Mac. I think we would have noticed if both the Mac and Windows builds of the beta release didn't work altogether(!), so it has to be something specific to your setup/preferences.

Can you try deleting your preferences, as well as disabling your plugins?


Tried that just now on Windows and it did nothing. It still crashes to the main menu as described in the other thread. I made sure to go into every game folder and Aleph One's app data folder to remove the preferences files too, including PID A1. I also opened every single instance of my Aleph One engine games on Windows to disable every plugin within them. Opening Marathon 1 A1 1.3 turns on its plugins even after disabling all others and turning this version's ones off. Doesn't matter if they are on or not as the result is the same.

Switching off mouse aiming (which isn't wise as outside PID I need mouse aiming) didn't work either. I also tried removing my Bluetooth Pro Controller connection in case it was goofing up there. No dice: Controller connections don't seem to be the problem. I also disabled my vjoy driver for my Switch joycons too. That also didn't work.


Specs for windows:

Processor: Intel(R) Core i7-3630QM CPU @ 2.40GHz
Installed RAM: 16GB (15.9 usable)
System Type: 64-bit operating system, x64-based processor

Windows Edition: Windows 10 Home
Version: 1803
Installed on 17.5.18
Build 17134.590

GPU: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 675 MX 4GB GDDR5
Drivers are only at least two versions under the current one (as NVIDIA updates its drivers too often and I don't want to have to constantly update and fix changed settings) My GeForce experience icon I would have used to check the driver version has disappeared.

The last couple of Windows 10 builds had the same issue with Aleph One 1.3. if there are other preferences elsewhere on my system needing deleted other than App Data and each game folder, I haven't found them. I don't know why this is happening nor why the exact same issue affects both my machines, especially as my Mac only has the most up to date versions as well as the Aleph One 1.3 betas. I haven't looked at my Mac specs just yet as I have something I need to do this morning.

EDIT:

Just checked my Mac specs now:

MacBook Pro (13", Mid2012)
Processor: 2.5 GHz Intel Core i5
RAM: 16GB 1600 MHz DDR3
Startup Disk: Macbook
Graphics Intel HD Graphics 4000 1536 MB

Tested switching off plugins for Marathon 1 and deleting the preferences file I could find. It also did not fix the crash to main menu bug. Once again, it astounds me that only I and one other person have this game breaking bug on both operating systems while others do not. Attempting the suggested fix did not seem to work which is disappointing as I hoped it would.

I point out that only certain maps fail while others seem to work. Every first level when clicking new game fails as it is the way I found out about the bug. Looking at the Mac version, Smells like Napalm does work. The other thread says that What Goes Up and Bigger Guns also work. That time was on Windows testing.

Once again, I cannot find any log files for the Mac version to see what went wrong in there. W'rkncacnter suggested it could be issues with controller detection, which is why mouselook in PID A1 is off by default. Even so, why would missing controller bindings cause certain maps to immediately quit to main menu like that?
Last edited by Lion O Cyborg on Mar 5th '19, 13:23, edited 1 time in total.
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Lion O Cyborg
UK (which is IN EUROPE!)

Post Mar 5th '19, 13:07

Don't delete the preferences in the game folder! Those are part of the scenario.

https://github.com/Aleph-One-Marathon/a ... -Locations

It's definitely something weird about your setup. If the Mac version crashes, you should get a crash report that might help. It's possible to get one in Windows but it requires some complicated extra steps.
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treellama
Pittsburgh

Post Mar 5th '19, 13:08

After you delete your preferences, are you trying to play before setting up your keys and everything? If not, try that too.
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treellama
Pittsburgh

Post Mar 5th '19, 13:44

I AM SO FUCKING STUPID!

Pardon my caps and french but I have been so stupid as I've figured it out:

I've always skipped chapter screens when playing Marathon with the escape key by double pressing it but in the new version, the 2nd keystroke actually carries over to the game itself, so Marathon thinks I'm trying to quit the game, even though I was only skipping the chapter screen. Same on Mac. The guy on Github was likely doing the same and like me, did not realise what was happening.

Image

Long story short, the game worked fine all this time and I never knew it because I was double pressing quit to skip chapter screens when I should have been pressing another key like Enter.
Last edited by Lion O Cyborg on Mar 5th '19, 16:01, edited 2 times in total.
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Lion O Cyborg
UK (which is IN EUROPE!)

Post Mar 5th '19, 14:27

The Man wrote:The beta of Aleph One 1.3 will load all the HD textures on Windows if you need screenshots, but it still has performance issues (it stutters fairly regularly). If you want to use the HD textures, I recommend using the Mac version.


Now that the problem I had with Aleph One 1.3 is sorted, I tried that and that does work. Thank you. I can still use the Mac version too.
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Lion O Cyborg
UK (which is IN EUROPE!)

Post Mar 5th '19, 15:36

Lion O Cyborg wrote:W'rkncacnter suggested it could be issues with controller detection, which is why mouselook in PID A1 is off by default.

No.
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Wrkncacnter

Post Mar 5th '19, 15:54

Wrkncacnter wrote:
Lion O Cyborg wrote:W'rkncacnter suggested it could be issues with controller detection, which is why mouselook in PID A1 is off by default.

No.


Well, you did mention in case it was relevant. I must have misinterpreted that to mean you thought it might be, when (as I see now too) you were actually just pointing out information related to the control issues in the log file were probably only in the log because mouse is off by default in PID A1.

Wrkncacnter wrote:One thing about AOPID (which is the only scenario working for him), the mouse aiming is disabled by default. I mention that in case it's relevant, because of the controller related issues in the log file.


The control issue wasn't the problem as I found out: I made the game think I was trying to quit it when I skipped chapter screens and didn't realise it.
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Lion O Cyborg
UK (which is IN EUROPE!)


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