-.-

Questions about the content creation procedure go here, including using Forge, Anvil, or other editors, or operating emulators like Basilisk II.

Post Jun 12th '07, 04:55

Ok since this never got answer in Stone Clenches topic i made a new thread for it. How do you make areas that are below other polygons? Like bridges that you can walk under and underground places that are under polygosn that you can walk on. And i'm trying to do tag switches but when i tagged the polygons i wanted to be raised when i hit one switch nothing happened and YES i did make sure the switch was set to the right tag. Multiple times in fact. Same goes with the platforms.
The world is filled with bastard covered bastards with bastard fillings.

THE CAKE IS A LIE!

|^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^| ||
|...BEER TRUCK..........| ||'|";, ___.
|_..._..._______===|=||_|__|......, ] -
"(@)'(@)"""**|(@)(@)*** **''(@)


I'MMA FIRIN' MAH LAZAR
Darkwrath
Wasilla, Alaska

Post Jun 12th '07, 11:37

-JC- wrote:Ok since this never got answer in Stone Clenches topic i made a new thread for it. How do you make areas that are below other polygons? Like bridges that you can walk under and underground places that are under polygosn that you can walk on. And i'm trying to do tag switches but when i tagged the polygons i wanted to be raised when i hit one switch nothing happened and YES i did make sure the switch was set to the right tag. Multiple times in fact. Same goes with the platforms.

To make a "bridge" that you can walk over requires good use of 5-D space. Born Slippy Nuxx from Underworld has a great example in it. I suggest looking at the map in Forge.
Bourne

Post Jun 12th '07, 12:27

I've been wondering about this too. If you have a polygon inside another polygon, yet below it, how do you make it below? i.e. overlapping passages, the sp'ht tower in m2 (the one with all the flick'ta), ect.
Can't speel for hist.
Phortiphy

Post Jun 12th '07, 13:19

Uh...set the floor height?

Guys, read the Forge manual, watch the tutorials. I keep saying it, and you keep not doing it.
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treellama
Pittsburgh

Post Jun 12th '07, 15:00

Dude. I spent five whole hours over that thing when I first figured out that I had forge. It told me everything that I could ever want except what wasn't glaringly obvious, i.e. the stuff i don't know. plus, the version that they use in the tutorials is like 1.1 or somthing.

yes, i do have the original thing that came with the mac action sac. (its a silly name, i know)
Can't speel for hist.
Phortiphy

Post Jun 12th '07, 15:11

Phortiphy wrote:Dude. I spent five whole hours over that thing when I first figured out that I had forge.

It took you 5 hours to read a short manual and you still missed the part (on page 51) where it explains exactly how to do what you just asked. Congratulations.
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treellama
Pittsburgh

Post Jun 12th '07, 15:40

Bourne wrote:To make a "bridge" that you can walk over requires good use of 5-D space.

That's still not what 5D space is. =(
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kineticturtle

Post Jun 12th '07, 17:06

Kinetic Turtle wrote:That's still not what 5D space is. =(

Yeah, it still is 5D space, cause both polys occupy the same area. I think that people are misunderstanding the question, or maybe I am. I think what JC means is how to make a "brigde" like in Born Slippy Nuxx, where you can go over the "brigde", but you can also go under the "bridge".
Bourne

Post Jun 12th '07, 17:27

Bourne wrote:Yeah, it still is 5D space, cause both polys occupy the same area.

No, if the polygons don't overlap height-wise, it's not "5D" space
User avatar

treellama
Pittsburgh

Post Jun 12th '07, 17:36

Treellama wrote:No, if the polygons don't overlap height-wise, it's not "5D" space

But they do occupy the same height. The bridge is "in" the ceiling of the other poly. Whatever, I don't know, what else would you call it?
Last edited by Bourne on Jun 12th '07, 17:38, edited 1 time in total.
Bourne

Post Jun 12th '07, 17:51

But they do occupy the same height. The bridge is "in" the ceiling of the other poly. Whatever, I don't know, what else would you call it?


...hacky 3D?

5D space implies that there are two separate rooms that actually, physically occupy the same dimensional space. Not that one room goes over another room.
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RyokoTK
Saint Paul, MN

Post Jun 12th '07, 18:04

The Forge "manual" is located inside another manual. Its too big and...oh forget it. As i've said before i've watched the forge tutorials numerous times and NO WHERE does it tell you how to make bridges. Maybe it talks about 5-D space a little but not very detailed. He even said it so fast i can't even do regular 5-D space, nor would i want to. It would be too complicated for me and a huge waste of my time (likewise to what i was gunna say about the Forge manual). If it is as simple as people have told me then can't you just tell me how to do it? I have actually opened up a couple maps that do this in Forge. Thats not good advice all i can see is that it goes over (under) other polygons which was blantly obvious but that doesn't tell you how to do it. I "attempted" to copy it picturewise but it didn't do anything.
Last edited by Darkwrath on Jun 12th '07, 18:06, edited 1 time in total.
The world is filled with bastard covered bastards with bastard fillings.

THE CAKE IS A LIE!

|^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^| ||
|...BEER TRUCK..........| ||'|";, ___.
|_..._..._______===|=||_|__|......, ] -
"(@)'(@)"""**|(@)(@)*** **''(@)


I'MMA FIRIN' MAH LAZAR
Darkwrath
Wasilla, Alaska

Post Jun 12th '07, 18:41

Bourne wrote:But they do occupy the same height. The bridge is "in" the ceiling of the other poly. Whatever, I don't know, what else would you call it?

They don't occupy the same height. And, since there's no other way to make a bridge in Marathon than having two polygons overlap, you could just call it a bridge. Or a covered bridge. "5D space" means there are areas accessible in the map that can not uniquely be described as a 3 dimensional point--which isn't necessarily the case for covered bridges. If one polygon has 0WU floor and 1 WU ceiling, and the one over it has 1.25 WU floor and 2.5 WU ceiling, the y co-ordinate makes it possible to uniquely describe any area in either polygon. If you're 1 WU high, it's polygon A, but if you're 2 WU high, it's polygon b.

It's when both have a floor height of 0 WU where you need a 4th dimension to describe the point, to differentiate between a point 1 WU high in polygon a, and 1 WU high in polygon b. The designers jokingly refer to time as a 4th dimension, thus "5D space"

It would be too complicated for me and a huge waste of my time (likewise to what i was gunna say about the Forge manual). If it is as simple as people have told me then can't you just tell me how to do it?

Considering the the lack of willingness of my audience to take some initiative, to be curious and figure out how things work; it would be too complicated for me, and a huge waste of my time.

If you seriously can't open a map in Forge, and figure out how someone else did something, and you're just plain unwilling to read something that's less than 100 pages of very large print text with pictures, that very explicitly says how they did it, perhaps mapping (or learning of any kind) is not for you. You could watch TV or something.
Last edited by treellama on Jun 12th '07, 18:44, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar

treellama
Pittsburgh

Post Jun 12th '07, 19:03

The things I do for some of you punks... see the attached image and example map.
Attachments
example.zip
(1.46 KiB) Downloaded 85 times
bridge.PNG
bridge.PNG (103.1 KiB) Viewed 5028 times
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RyokoTK
Saint Paul, MN

Post Jun 12th '07, 20:29

I think what Bourne means in this whole 5D space terminology discussion is that these bridges (and any room-over-room situation) would not be possible unless the engine supported 5D space in the first place.
underworld : simple fun netmaps // prahblum peack : simple rejected netmaps
azure dreams : simple horrible netmaps // v6.0!!!: thomas mann's greatest hits : simple simple netmaps
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irons
(.Y.)

Post Jun 12th '07, 20:48

irons wrote:I think what Bourne means in this whole 5D space terminology discussion is that these bridges (and any room-over-room situation) would not be possible unless the engine supported 5D space in the first place.

There are plenty of engines that support rooms over rooms, and don't support so-called 5D space...
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treellama
Pittsburgh

Post Jun 12th '07, 20:52

So, what if you removed that ability from the Marathon engine? Would we have room-over-room?
underworld : simple fun netmaps // prahblum peack : simple rejected netmaps
azure dreams : simple horrible netmaps // v6.0!!!: thomas mann's greatest hits : simple simple netmaps
User avatar

irons
(.Y.)

Post Jun 12th '07, 21:01

irons wrote:So, what if you removed that ability from the Marathon engine? Would we have room-over-room?

It would be possible to disable 5D space in the engine without disabling bridges, yes. But I see what you're saying: the ability to do 5D space comes from the way the engine does rooms-over-rooms.
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treellama
Pittsburgh

Post Jun 12th '07, 21:02

Yeah, that's what I meant. Sorry for the lazy wording.
underworld : simple fun netmaps // prahblum peack : simple rejected netmaps
azure dreams : simple horrible netmaps // v6.0!!!: thomas mann's greatest hits : simple simple netmaps
User avatar

irons
(.Y.)

Post Jun 13th '07, 13:02

Where would I find the manual, I looked around for a bit but I saw nothing obvious
Can't speel for hist.
Phortiphy

Post Jun 13th '07, 13:22

Phortiphy wrote:Where would I find the manual, I looked around for a bit but I saw nothing obvious


yes, i do have the original thing that came with the mac action sac.


...
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treellama
Pittsburgh

Post Jun 13th '07, 13:53

Treellama wrote:...on page 51...

THE
MANUAL
THAT
CAME
AS
PART
OF
THE
CD
ONLY
HAS
33
PAGES!!!!

I said that earlier, but somebody took my post out. That manual is the only thing beside a few short readme's and the tutorials that mention forge, and the manual itself is the original M3 manual, which has a small 18 page stint on Forge, then moves on to Anvil
Can't speel for hist.
Phortiphy

Post Jun 13th '07, 14:31

Phortiphy wrote:THE
MANUAL
THAT
CAME
AS
PART
OF
THE
CD
ONLY
HAS
33
PAGES!!!!

I said that earlier, but somebody took my post out. That manual is the only thing beside a few short readme's and the tutorials that mention forge, and the manual itself is the original M3 manual, which has a small 18 page stint on Forge, then moves on to Anvil

It's the same manual. You still clearly haven't read it. Please stop posting in this thread.
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treellama
Pittsburgh

Post Jun 13th '07, 14:37

*sigh*

How can A manual have page 51 if I COUNTED and got around (give or take a few) 34?[attachment=661:M3guide.png]
Attachments
M3guide.png
M3guide.png (46.33 KiB) Viewed 5008 times
Last edited by Phortiphy on Jun 13th '07, 14:42, edited 1 time in total.
Can't speel for hist.
Phortiphy

Post Jun 13th '07, 15:03

Why does it matter how many pages yours is broken into? The stuff in it it still the same.
User avatar

treellama
Pittsburgh

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