Better mouse control, please

Have a question, suggestion, or comment about Aleph One's features and functionality (Lua, MML, the engine itself, etc)? Post such topics here.
Post Reply
User avatar
Blastfrog
Cyborg
Posts: 77
Joined: Dec 4th '11, 01:15
Contact:

I feel this is something Aleph One desperately needs. Mouse control is the major thing that puts newcomers off.

I know part of it has to do with film compatibility, but I honestly don't see the issue. Old demos could still play back fine, and new demos could be recorded with a new input system.

I suggest having a significantly higher resolution angle/pitch measurement (at least 16x, so 4 more bits), and removing the speed caps. I know the engine itself only handles 512 degrees IIRC, so the hi-res stuff could be rounded for internal use. Other than that, have the hi-res affect camera angle/pitch, but not the gamesim.

I imagine that speed cap removal would be less of an issue, since you could just set the angle/pitch to whatever at any tick, as opposed to writing in new angle/pitch handling on the gamesim.
______

Alternately, I suggest a "virtual mouse" that drives the original protocol. Basically, the user drives a "target point" that the "virtual mouse" driver drives the original protocol to try going to that (converted) target position as quickly as possible.

This may be a less intensive solution.
User avatar
RyokoTK
Vidmaster
Posts: 4161
Joined: Mar 7th '06, 07:04
Location: Saint Paul, MN

I'm on it, I'll use these suggestions and make it work.
User avatar
treellama
Vidmaster
Posts: 6107
Joined: Jun 2nd '06, 02:05
Location: Pittsburgh
Contact:

You can submit patches to GitHub.
User avatar
RyokoTK
Vidmaster
Posts: 4161
Joined: Mar 7th '06, 07:04
Location: Saint Paul, MN

Cool, I was wondering where to deposit these.
User avatar
Wrkncacnter
Vidmaster
Posts: 1948
Joined: Jan 29th '06, 03:51
Contact:

Aw shit, I was going to do it, but it looks like Ryoko beat me to it. You get all the glory.
User avatar
General Tacticus
Cyborg
Posts: 209
Joined: Apr 5th '13, 04:27

having spoken to a few newcomers from the zdoom community in my time, the mouse control has without fail been the biggest turn off. It would be nice if a solution were found (time permitting). I'd think user input would be a higher priority than film compatibility, as the former would actually add to the player experience.
User avatar
Blastfrog
Cyborg
Posts: 77
Joined: Dec 4th '11, 01:15
Contact:

@RyokoTK: Yes, thank you! I sincerely appreciate it. If you'd like me to do anything in return, like graphics work or something, please let me know.

EDIT: Wait, you weren't being sarcastic about doing it, were you?

EDIT 2: Of course you were being sarcastic. Oh well, at least I found someone who is actually willing to fix this longstanding problem.

@General Tacticus: Yep, this is exactly why it's important. Marathon's traditional mouse control is objectively crap when compared to other FPS games. One can get used to it, but it drives off so many people.
Last edited by Blastfrog on Jul 13th '16, 03:31, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
General Tacticus
Cyborg
Posts: 209
Joined: Apr 5th '13, 04:27

Has anybody considered actively bringing in outside help to work on development? I'm sure there are a few guys in the doom sourceport community who would lend a hand if asked.
User avatar
Blastfrog
Cyborg
Posts: 77
Joined: Dec 4th '11, 01:15
Contact:

General Tacticus wrote:Has anybody considered actively bringing in outside help to work on development? I'm sure there are a few guys in the doom sourceport community who would lend a hand if asked.
I guess I could try to convince some people. Key word: try.

EDIT: Attempt potentially successful. I've got someone looking into it.
User avatar
irons
Vidmaster
Posts: 2651
Joined: Mar 1st '06, 20:44
Location: (.Y.)
Contact:

I thought you weren't dumb, then I read the posts of this past week.
User avatar
General Tacticus
Cyborg
Posts: 209
Joined: Apr 5th '13, 04:27

Is it really necessary for you be an ass?
User avatar
3371-Alpha
Cyborg
Posts: 328
Joined: Nov 6th '15, 01:26
Location: Veldin Orbit

Blastfrog, most members of this community are either busy with other work (Hopper, treellama, ect.) or busy being asses (Wrk, irons, ect.). If they're being asses, don't take it personal, it's how they make friends.

Although Apple Computer isn't a perfect wonderful company, there's a lesson that can be learned from them. When John Skully ousted Steve Jobs, he attempted to create a software company called NeXT. NeXT created an operating system that would compete with Windows NT in the x86 PC world, called NeXTSTEP. However few hardware companies payed attention to NeXT, preferring to include a version of Windows with their hardware instead. When things turned to shit over at Apple (John Skully was terrible at managing money), they attempted to buy NeXT to bring Jobs back. Although Apples always designed their hardware, Jobs decided he's never going to license his OS to another company ever again after that.

The important part is Jobs attempted to sell the OS to other companies, but none of them wanted it: he couldn't depend on them. When he returned to Apple, he went back to making both his own OS & hardware to go along with it. The moral of the story is: if you want if done right (or just done in general) do it yourself.

I my self have had many ideas for improving the Aleph One engine, but they were either dismissed by Hopper as he's too busy creating the next build, or shot down by iron cause he's an ass. Personally, I've bought a few "Learn to Program C" books and I'm already practicing. I advise you to do the same.

P.S. Blastfrog, I think you're making too many threads. If people ignored your first thread, making another wont make them listen, it will just give irons an excuse to insult you.
PowerMac G5 Dual 2.0GHz 2003 (Model: 7,2)
Mac OS X 10.5.8 (Leopard)
7GB RAM (OWC PC-3200U-30330 DDR SDRAM 400MHz)
ATi Radeon X800 XT (GPU overclocked to 500MHz, VRAM to 550MHz)
User avatar
irons
Vidmaster
Posts: 2651
Joined: Mar 1st '06, 20:44
Location: (.Y.)
Contact:

I'm just trying to help, guys.
User avatar
hawkeyefile
Cyborg
Posts: 195
Joined: Nov 30th '06, 06:50
Location: In front of my terminal debugging mainframes...
Contact:

Everyone thought I was stupid for asking for better mouse support years ago. Good luck. It's one of the reasons I quit playing the game for a long spell.
User avatar
Wrkncacnter
Vidmaster
Posts: 1948
Joined: Jan 29th '06, 03:51
Contact:

Asking for other people to do it is generally not productive. Doing it yourself would be the non-stupid way of getting it done. Sounds like Blastfrog's actually got someone to look at it, so maybe he's got it figured out.
User avatar
herecomethej2000
Mjolnir Mark IV
Posts: 632
Joined: Jan 22nd '06, 17:26
Contact:

irons wrote:I'm just trying to help, guys.
And you are doing an excellent job! Don't ever change.
Post Reply